MyFox
 

Sageman's Blog

by Sageman from Orlando

Last Post 113 days, 23 hours Ago


I'm the first to admit that people get emotional over the war in Iraq. I think, along with the Vietnam War, this will go down as one of the worst conflicts in American History. Yet it will also be one of the most important conflicts we have participated in and in many ways it has taught us some valuable lessons.

The first lesson is, "Finish what you start." We left Iraq the first time with so many things unfinished, that in itself could be seen as the leading cause for the issues we are dealing with now. If we had finished the job the first time, with the support of the Middle East and the majority of the UN, it would have not cost us as much in both lives and dollars.

Because we were nearsighted the first time, we are now footing the bill for a war that is looking to bankrupt our country. Yet while the country goes bankrupt, the same business' that made money off the cold war are once again making money off this war. The leaders of these companies and the investors are the same people pushing to stay in Iraq, saying finish the job. I think their motives are suspect but I do agree, that to leave before the job is finished will hurt us more in the long run.

The second lesson we learned from this war is, "Check your sources." To many mistakes were made because politicians went off the words of their advisor's with out making sure that the information was valid. It seem's that now the whole "Weapons of Mass Destructions (WMDs)" became more of a hypothesis rather than a fact. No one with an ounce of common sense would doubt whether Saddam was working on WMDs but now we really have to ask just how major of a threat it was to us. Many would agree that taking a little more time to plan would have added to our success in Iraq.

The third lesson is, "Don't get involved in something with out knowing the social dynamics first." We tried to win "Hearts and Minds," based on the assumption that we could apply the same standards of our western culture towards a middle eastern culture. I find it hard to believe that no one ever told the leaders in charge, the Shiites and Sunnis don't like each other at all. Now we find out one of the reasons for stability in the region came from Saddam's iron hand. His tactics seem to be the only thing that kept these people from each other's throats the first time. Not condoning Saddam's actions but just point out a fact.

The fourth lesson is, "Don't spread yourself to thin." Finish one war before getting involved in another conflict. If we had spent a year or two emphasizing an end to the conflict in Afghanistan, the conflict in Iraq might have ended in a whole different way.

I guess that sums up what I was trying to say, I might have missed some things. I am for finishing the job but I'm also for getting our troops out of harms way ASAP too. Limiting the amount of troops we send over there and putting more of the job on the shoulders of the Iraqi Army should be tantamount right now. We'll have to see how things shape up but I don't see an end to this for a long time down the road.

Also remember, hindsight is 20/20. Taking that vision and learning the lessons taught will be the real victory in Iraq.
33 Comments |  Add a Comment

Member Comments Total Comments: 33
Page 1 of 2
1
Last
candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 30, 2008 | 9:48 PM

O.k. Sageman......then VOTE FOR YOUR SHITLERY AND OBAMA.......AND LETS JUST ALL BE REAL MISERABLE WHEN AL QUEDA is allow into our Country......some of you amaze me....yeah right.....Iraq SHOULD NOT AND DOESN'T COMPARE TO VIETNAM.........at all.......what do you read....oh wait THE DEMOCRAPPY TIMES........i forgot.....yes, lets pull our troops SO WE CAN ALL DIE......AND LOOK BLOGGERS LOOK WHO DIED AND LEFT SAGE TO DO THE SWEET SPEECHES...OH SO PEACHY........gimme a break......DEMOCRAPS LIKE YOU is exactly why I RAN THE OTHER WAY......get off the dam coolaid.....the democrap coolaid that is.

DaytonaFrank read my blog view my photos
Mar 30, 2008 | 10:03 PM

That is very sage, Sage!

My very first post almost a year ago reflected this! It has long been deleted, but I made some of the same points, and more.

The main one now is, that regardless of whether or not we should have gone into Iraq, we are there and must win.

We MUST finish what we started!

There is NO alternative!

Good post, but we will ALWAYS have a base in Iraq, and if the libs give it away, start counting down the days to the end of the US!

Sageman read my blog
Mar 30, 2008 | 10:17 PM

Candy... I never state at one time that we should pull out our troops. I think you should read it again. I will say that the war in Iraq has done little to stem the terrorism committed by Al-qeada if anything finishing what we started in Afghanistan would have more of an impact on Al-qeada.

Also this war does compare to Vietnam, both were started to stop an enemy of the United States from spreading and posing a threat to our interests.

Lastly, I support my troops one hundred percent. I'm not a sheep, I'm not going to paint the war to a peachy thing at all. If you read again I say that we need to stay in this war and that we need to be there for the long haul to make sure we own up to our responsibilities.

I do say that we need to give more responsibility to Iraq but I know way implied in anyway that we are supposed to pull out of Iraq. I seriously don't get where you got from point a to where ever you are, from what I wrote?

I'm not a peacenik, I'm not so naive to think that there can always be peace through negotiation BUT I do believe talking is always the first option, fighting is the absolute last one. Don't put words in my mouth that are based on your inability to interpret what I have written.

Horizon2008
Mar 30, 2008 | 11:36 PM

Candyaquino- I just finished reading your statement and it's really hard for me not to make a remark about what you wrote. First you should try to learn to use punctuation and proper grammar. I understand as a Legal Secretary you're probably allowed to write however you choose and the placement of a comma... oh wait that kind of stuff does matter to a legal secretary. Sorry, my bad. Second, if you think calling people names or making derogatory phrases about them is debating, then you need to go to school, or at least graduate high school.

The one thing I find offensive is that you call Hillary Clinton "Shitlery" and Obama "Obama"... that seems racist to me. Couldn't you find an equally offensive name for Obama or is it just okay to make derogatory comments about white folk?

Really all I read in your statement was incoherent ramblings. Your point is? Typing quick little quips and sound bites might seem like you're actually debating or arguing a point, but in reality all you're doing is proving how little you actually know about the topic.

My suggestion, go and read a little about Vietnam and then compare it to Iraq. My case in point, both were wars that we didn't want to be involved in, both were wars that the majority of people back home wanted nothing to do with, and both were financially strangling our economy.

Also, prior to starting a rant, perhaps you should actually read what's been written. I can't see anywhere in Sageman's post where he advocated removing troops from Iraq.

Now with that being said, I'm not a democrat or republican. I'm a moderate,

Horizon2008
Mar 30, 2008 | 11:38 PM

Candyaquino- I just finished reading your statement and it's really hard for me not to make a remark about what you wrote. First you should try to learn to use punctuation and proper grammar. I understand as a Legal Secretary you're probably allowed to write however you choose and the placement of a comma... oh wait that kind of stuff does matter to a legal secretary. Sorry, my bad. Second, if you think calling people names or making derogatory phrases about them is debating, then you need to go to school, or at least graduate high school.

The one thing I find offensive is that you call Hillary Clinton "Shitlery" and Obama "Obama"... that seems racist to me. Couldn't you find an equally offensive name for Obama or is it just okay to make derogatory comments about white folk?

Really all I read in your statement was incoherent ramblings. Your point is? Typing quick little quips and sound bites might seem like you're actually debating or arguing a point, but in reality all you're doing is proving how little you actually know about the topic.

My suggestion, go and read a little about Vietnam and then compare it to Iraq. My case in point, both were wars that we didn't want to be involved in, both were wars that the majority of people back home wanted nothing to do with, and both were financially strangling our economy.

Also, prior to starting a rant, perhaps you should actually read what's been written. I can't see anywhere in Sageman's post where he advocated removing troops from Iraq.

Now with that being said, I'm not a democrat or republican. I'm a moderate,

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 9:26 AM

Listen....Horizon you really need to broaden your horizon......lets worry about my commas shall we, my BEING A PARALEGAL.....doesn't apply to when I BLOG...I BLOG HOWEVER I WANT TO AND I USE OR DONT USE GOOD GRAMMAR.what is wrong with you people..yet if you look BACK ON EVERYONES BLOG.....hello, AMERICANS ARE MISPELLING AND MIS PRONOUNCING.....so you people just seem to focus on my freaking grammar offensive..I don't have to read ABOUT VIETNAM....MY HUSBAND SERVED IN VIETNAM...o.k. and Sageman's comments and/or his opinion IS JUST THAT....HIS..and no one else's I hope that's ok we are in AMERICA AND LAST I HEARD WE STILL EXERCISE FREEDOM OF SPEECH...and I can't compare Vietnam to Iraq...I DON'T SEE THE CONNECTION HERE......what I can't express my feelings of the lovely candidates????? Obama isn't that spelled correctly and what's this you or neither you are A MODERATE....WHAT ON EARTH IS AN MODERATE???? It just keeps getting better...If you are moderate ...then I will be moderate to rotten...does that satisfy you????? AND WHERE WERE YOU ON 9-11??? DID YOU LOSE LOVED ONES??? INNOCENT LIVES ??? WELL LET ME TELL YOU HORIZON I DID...AND IT WILL BE WITH BE FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE..FIRST OF ALL, SECOND, WE ARE IN IRAQ BECAUSE WE HAVE TOO..whether you and others think otherwise this is far from Vietnam..THIS IS WHERE ALQUEDA and all those pieces of rat filfth are hiding in their caves..WE ARE THERE FOR TERRORISTS.......hardly I can't compare that to Vietnam AT ALL!!! and our economy IS JUST NOT STRUGLING DO TO THIS WAR..ON TERRORIST..my friend there's lots of other issues SO I DO

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 9:35 AM

OOPS MADE A TYPO. how about that..meant to say we are not struggling DUE TO THIS WAR.. con't

NOT STRUGLING DO TO THIS WAR..ON TERRORIST..my friend there's lots of other issues SO I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU ARE GETTING INFORMED..or should I say MISINFORMED..if it isnt' the fact that you keep focusing of the democraps..craps..that GOT US HERE IN THE FIRST PLACE...by the way did you hear the news this morning. I truly feel sorry for people like you that refused TO BELIEVE THESE TERRORIST ARE STILL AMONG US..just lurking and waiting FOR US TO PULLED THE TROOPS - SO WE CAN UP ..to smithering......with that said I hope I have satisfied your commas issued and ranting.......and remember I CAN RANT IF I WANT TO RANT IF I WANT TOO you would RANT TOO IF IT HAPPENED TO YOU!!!!

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 9:38 AM

Horizon2008 writes:

My case in point, both were wars that we didn't want to be involved in, both were wars that the majority of people back home wanted nothing to do with, and both were financially strangling our economy.


Well I certainly DO NOT AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT AND/OR POINT...NOT AT ALL AND NEITHER DOES MY HUSBAND WHO FOUGHT FOR THIS COUNTRY AND HE DOESN'T REGRET NOT ONE BIT OF IT..and my heart goes to the young military KILLED BY TERRORIST..perhaps you like to TELL THAT TO THE PARENTS OF THIS SOLDIER..may he REST IN PEACE...........

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 9:42 AM

and please tell ME WHAT ON EARTH IS A MODERATE........DEMOCRAT..........because in my life time YOU ARE EITEHR A DEMOCRAP OR A REPUBLICAN......I guess like ebonic or whatever attempt to change THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE.......NOW WE ARE CHANGING POLITICS terminology..eh?......just what we need..CONFUSE OUR YOUNGENS SOME MORE........hey kid want to be A MODERATE DEMO................NOT......like you like spicy Democrat; medium spicy or light Democrat.......whatever!!!

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 9:43 AM

and I am so sorry did I say shitherly..I must of had BLEEP on my mind...........I really meant to say hitlery....my English is getting worse with all the immigration problems...I will get it together..but thanks for bringing that up to my attention also.

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 9:53 AM

on another note, I am very spiritual person and I can't help to feel, in my opinion, Horizon that Sageman here put you up to this, you wouldn't be planning something against me would you...after all what are blogs for?????... truly what would be the sense of having blogs If i were to agreed with every bloger on here......blogin is to express one's feelings and opinion...it just wouldn't be the same if everyone would agreed??? don't ya think

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 10:00 AM

Sageman writes: Candy... I never state at one time that we should pull out our troops

I do say that we need to give more responsibility to Iraq but I know way implied in anyway that we are supposed to pull out of Iraq. I seriously don't get where you got from point a to where ever you are, from what I wrote?
(Funny however the blog that I read above said:

guess that sums up what I was trying to say, I might have missed some things. I am for finishing the job but I'm also for getting our troops out of harms way ASAP too. Limiting the amount of troops we send over there and putting more of the job on the shoulders of the Iraqi Army should be tantamount right now. We'll have to see how things shape up but I don't see an end to this for a long time down the road

so getting the troops out of harms way...I can imply that as pulling the troops??? or not??? am I reading this wrong...please somebody help me

LLRucker read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 11:30 AM

I think there are several comparisons to Viet Nam that can be made with this Irag war. The thing I find most disturbing about it, is not the cost (dollar wise anyway) or even the length of time we spend there, but the constant bickering over when to pull out.
For us to simply pull out and leave Iraq in shambles both politically and financially is just too reminescent of Viet Nam. We simply left there. Left. Pulled out, deserted the South Viet Namese people and left them to fend for themselves. In essence we totally wasted 58,000 American lives for nothing,and for us to even contemplate doing the same thing, and for virtually the same resons is sinful.
We went into the war or conflict or police action or whatever term you choose to apply to it based on the information, however erroneous it was.
We are there, and we simply can not just withdraw our support to the Iraqi people and leave them at the mercy of the terrorists.
Obama was right about one thing: When John McCain said that to pull out of Iraq now would be to open the door for al Queda to move in, Obama said, "I got news for Mr. mcCain, al Queda already IS in Iraq." Yes, they are, and we can in no way, not in good conscience anyway, leave those people to deal with the horrors of that group of fanatical lunatics.
There is no easy answer to the Iraq quesion, but to pull out and simply leave is to dishonor the 4000 Americans who died over there, and to in essence say to their families that their sacrifices were for nothing.
We need to finsh the job and finish it well and quickly with a minimumm amount of American c

LLRucker read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 11:34 AM

Candy, al Queda is already here, and for you to believe otherwise is akin to burying your head in the sand. Not only are they here, but they've been here for years. Hell, you may even have one or two living in your neighborhood.

LLRucker read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 11:47 AM

One other point Candy, and I'm not picking on you or doubting your words, but my husband was in Viet Nam too. If your husband has no regrets or second thoughts about that conflict, then he is in a minority. I know many, many Viet Nam vets, and there are very few who agreed with that conflict or wanted to be there. Remember, back then we still had the draft and not many of the young men who served in Viet Nam did so willingly.
War is war, soldiers die, and no amount of arguing or politicking will ever change that.
The only people who want us to pull out of Iraq are people like Clinton and Obama and their supporters, and these are people who never had to sweat bullets every time the phone rang in the middle of the night because their son or daughter was in harms way.
Wouldn't it be lovely if they gave a war and nobody came? Would that could ever happen.
Oh, and al Queda and bin Laden are hiding in those caoves in the mountains of Afghanistan, not Iraq, though you are right they're faily deeply entrenched there as well.
But, never think for a minute that they're not here, because they are.

cookie-lady read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 11:51 AM

Sage,

Spoken like a true wannabee lawyer...yes, that would be a good career choice for you...study on.
But as you go forward, be careful who you pizzle off, they just could be your friends one day.

Oh, wait...lawyers? Maybe not.

KISSHANK read my blog
Mar 31, 2008 | 12:49 PM

Yes candy you keep showing how uneducated you are..You cant even speak english properly..So how can you even reason to vote the right way? Look George W started this mismangaed war... And now he cant stop it..its out of control.>so he is going to leave this blunder to the next president... I truly do doubt that we will ever leave Iraq... No matter who the president is..But with a democrat we can at least try to leave this quagmire that is Iraq... The Iraqis have been fighting each other for centuries... What makes anyone think that we can just go in and stop it? We cant and we shouldnt.. Before this war started there wasnt such a thing in Iraq as a insurgent..We have brought the Insurgents to Iraq... and they will bankrupt our country.. So I say .>Should we leave..Oh heck yeah ..Leave!!! NOW before we get any deeper in a country that doesnt want us and considers us not a liberator but as a occupier

dks75 read my blog
Mar 31, 2008 | 12:49 PM

I can see where sageman is coming from.. I didnt agree with our reasons for going, but I think in this day and age there isn't anything we shouldn't do to overthrow dictators and those accused of genocide. Like Batista, closing those public institutions that were outspoken, and killing those that opposed him.. I'm starting to think Candies's family is nothing but Batista supporters and thats why they are here. It's easy to run a puppet democratic government from Miami

PegasusWing read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 1:08 PM

Kisshank, they have been fighting eachother for millennia, over 2 thousand years. We won't finish what we start even in McCain's next 100 years.
This is the desert Viet Nam. Only worse.
Our cultures are so different, that we will never come to terms. Muslims are taught from birth to hate us.
We need to get out of there and stay out.
They need to get out of here and stay out.
That will work.

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 2:31 PM

LL Rucker...kinda acceptable of your first posting...however, trust me......Al Queda is here there EVERWHERE...........I learned that on 9-11 thanks to Bill Clinton.........I don't know what on earth gave you the idea THAT I BELIEVE OTHERWISE.......AS TO your remark regarding Obama I can't believe he ACKNOWLEDGE AL QUEDA...thought they were related and thus why NOBODY LIKES HIM IN THE FIRST PLACE.......lol

as for the exception of Cookie lady...the rest of you and your whiney democrapsasssses..can kiss me WHERE THE SUN DON'T SHINE.....sorry LL Rucker..that's excluding you too......NOTICE EXCLUDING......just one last thing your husband sounds more like Jane Fonda's kind words towards vietnamese......is he hanoy also???

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 2:34 PM

and again.......YOUR OPINIONS..ARE YOURS....see how typical DEMOCRAPS you people can be......if not your way of thinking nothing else matters........good luck....you people are going to needed......LLRucker Al queda; bin laden CAN ALSO BE IN YOUR BACK YARD SIPPING ON SOME SORT OF TALIBAN OR MAYBE HE IS ALSO HAVING DEMOCRAP COOLAID......who knows...we wont until he comes back AND HE WILL..and you people will GET A RUDE AWEKENING...

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 2:40 PM

and don't misquote me LLRucker which most of you people seem to always do and PLEASE UNDERSTAND ONE THING...i TRULY can careless who picks on who..this is just a blog and who thinks I wrong unlike me....who just intake what I read as the bloger's opinion and just give my own..I DON'T TRY TO FORCE WHAT I OPINE about any blog...geeze and I thought I had problems..My husband has said he often thought it was a waste of time.....to be in Vietnam..but I DON'T THINK BEING IN IRAQ IS A WASTE AND I CAN'T COMPARE THE TWO..like whatever you people think...and that's it...simple as that......what you think is a waste......to me IS A WORTHY AND NECESSARY CAUSE OF ACTION...AND LETS NOT FORGET TO THANK PRESIDENT CLINTON..FOR BEING SO ALERT..oh wait he was busy playing with cigars.. and KISSHANK...LIKE YOU ARE SO WELL EDUCATED EXCUSE ME FOR BREATHING........just because you have your democrappy mentality and NO ONE seems to fall ON IT......sorry chump..that's yoru PROBLEMO not mind....LMAOFFFF.........lets get serious...LETS VOTE FOR McCAIN and stop all the bullshiet

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 2:49 PM

I gotta tell you though......when you sipped on the democrap coolaid and you believe and you are so stubborn NOT TO LOOK OUTSIDE THE BOX......just remember IT WAS YOUR DEMOCRAPPY PRESIDENT THAT PUT US HERE AND STOP BLAMING BUSH.....if anything he has tried and still continues to keep AMERICA SAFE..and is funny no one had a prolbem...NOTICE ALL THIS BULLSHIET IS JUST OUT WHEN THE PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGNING STARTS..........just typical of the democraps....to bash and destroy.......GOD BLESS AMERICA..........AND AS TO DICK AND HIS BATISTA REMARKS..maybe you support al queda heck you can be hiding someone in your loft or backyard.........NO LIKE IT RIGHT...still I say may God triples on to you all your good wishes and thoughts that you have upon me. Life is good......live, laugh and stop WHINING...

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 3:19 PM

oh and Dick I made no mention of anyone's family on this posts.....why on earth would you talk about my family and how do we know you are not part of al queda or your family..next time you decide to bring someone's family THAT YOU DONT' KNOW INTO THE PIX.......just don't get insulted when I talk and bash yours......thank you.

Sage..I just read you bio...and lots of luck to you and your becoming a lawyer. Personally I always commend anyone that has the ability, capability and courage to go back and finish the grade.......KUDOS. I will, however, pray that you will be GOOD LAWYER AND NOT ONE THAT SEES GREEN without the least bit concern or remorse of the outcome of your cases.....truly lots of luck in your endeavor..

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 3:21 PM

LLRucker I am pleased to always converse or debate with you..you are a professional and smart person no doubt. The mere fact that you are a writers just tickles me pink as I love literature as ileterate sometimes I blogs...anyway...my hope someday is to write my own book..have many diaries since 1970 when I started maybe one day we will have the pleasure of meeting and you can help me..I THINK IT WOULD BE A BEST-SELLER without a doubt!

dks75 read my blog
Mar 31, 2008 | 4:43 PM

Candy, your right and I owe you apology.. So I'm saying sorry. It was out uncalled for and out of line.

Truth be told I just like your post when you get angry. How does this sound: I will never anger you with anything other than the facts or an opinion from now on.

candyaquino read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 6:32 PM

awh........dks do you really mean it..are or you messing with me again.......LOL.......just keep the family out of it....alright......I don't mess with no one's mammas and pappas.....I get touchy...specially since they are not with me.......you are probably in your thirties.....and you still doing the dirties....I know......its cool......take care..just keep family out......everything else.......cool baby cool.....

Ericjhach read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 6:36 PM

Nuke em all and let God sort them out.

dks75 read my blog
Mar 31, 2008 | 6:37 PM

I mean it... really I guess I just got stupid for a moment or 3... heh yep early 30's your good =) You have my word it'll never ever happen again.

I guess now might be a good time to get back on topic

Abunai read my blog view my photos
Mar 31, 2008 | 6:42 PM

OK Lets look at Vietnam vs. Iraq then:

Financially.. People fall into the sensationalism of the dollar number, without even looking into perspective.

WWII for example cost less than Iraq and the war on terror in dollar numbers BUT!! WWII was spending 25% of the nation's GDP where Iraq and the war on terror is 1%
Typical defense budget is still only 20% of the annual budget and SS,Medicare/Medicaid are much greater.

Lives lost: Iraq's total numbers took 5 years to reach over 4000. We lost 3000 Americans in the first hours of 9/11.

The media however tried with its liberal friends to relive Vietnam by pumping all the negatives into your livingroom, but this time its not just Walter Cronkite literally snatching Victory from us in a 22 minute news broadcast, but a cable news 24/7 round the clock media that still didn't show the new schools, hospitals, potable water, edible food, sewer systems and all infrastructure. Even so far as to spin electrical power sharing in a failed light and no perspective or historical context.

Page 1 of 2
1
Last


Write your comment below:




Sageman

I have been an actor, writer, and journalist, among other things. Currently I am getting ready to go back to school. I think that news, as clichè as it sounds, is one day away from being history. I enjoy reading, writing, running, biking and swimming. Ironically I hate the Triathlon. Yet I believe exercise is the key to a happy life! Politically I'm a Moderate Democrat and I listen to anyone's views, the only thing that really irks me is people who insult others for having different views. Which often makes me insult them in turn. I guess that makes me a Hypocrite... At least I won't be lonely.

Member Since: 3/19/2008